Yes, The Rep Vits are per gram I think
And Priscilla's vits are in Kg but are per 7 tablespoons.

Like I said, actual math calculations are up to someone else... I stink at math, and truly abhore it with all my being, but someone else can feel free to take off with the info and do a comparitive analysis.

I think all new info is good info, since we know so little anyway. As long as it is presented as truthfully and non-bias as possible!

My goal was just too visually see what was in one that wasn't in another, etc.

The rep vits are per gram or kilogram? Also I need to verify: IU stands for Internation Unit, which describes an arbitrary amount of a substance agreed upon by scientists and doctors... but I forgot... *banging head* so is that still considered grams in this case? How is IU used again...?

I'm doing the caluclations now but I need these questions answered first.

Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

For the Herptivite it says per Kg. I tried to find what i could about IU and I found that 1 IU will vary from substance to substance. This web page fortunately has the measurements for the three vits we would need it for- Vits E, D and A.
</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
Examples: 1 IU represents 45.5 micrograms of a standard preparation of insulin or 0.6 microgram of a standard preparation of penicillin. Consumers most often see IU's on the labels of vitamin packages: in standard preparations the equivalent of 1 IU is 0.3 microgram (0.0003 mg) for vitamin A, 50 micrograms (0.05 mg) for vitamin C, 25 nanograms (0.000 025 mg) for vitamin D, and 2/3 milligram for (natural) vitamin E.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">
I know it's best to link to other sites, but just to make thinks a smidge easier I did put this quote from my link above. I hope that is OK.

Thanks, angelafx. Another problem.

Ahhhh! I don't have a weighing scale! Can someone please weigh a tablespoon of Herptivite for me? I need to know approximately how many grams of Herptivite are in a tablespoon? Or atleast how many tablespoons of powder are in a full container of Herptivite (if anyone has access to an unopened container)? Thanks.

Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

I can weigh the tablespoon, but as for the whole container, I don't have one right now. be back in a minute with the numbers... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />

well, it's 10g
I didn't pack it, I just scooped it loose and levelled it.
Hope that helps. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

Oh BTW I think that the reason that Priscilla was reluctant to give the actual recipe to her supplement out is because she is supposedly working on getting a patent for the vitamin mix she sells.
That is cool that she gave a vitamin breakdown <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />

OK, I've decided to calculate the figures of Pricilla's Vits to the units: mg/tablespoon (simply because kg/tablespoon would involve way too many zeros on the screen and there is no superscript option so unfortunately I can't express the calculations in scientific notation) and they are rounded to two significant digits.

I did Pricilla's vits first because the calculations were the easiest.

Anyway, here they are. Feel free to correct any errors. i converted all the IU figures to total mg. I converted all mcg (micrograms to mg) and I simply divided it by the total number of tablespoons, namely 7.

Pricilla's Vitamins:

Vitamin A = 0.64 mg/tablespoon

Vitamin C = 142.86 mg/tablespoon

Vitamin D2 = 0.0018 mg/tablespoon

Vitamin E = 38.06 mg/tablespoon

Vitamin K = 0.000 071 mg/tablespoon

Thiamine B-1 = 3.57 mg/tablespoon

Riboflavin B-2 = 3.57 mg/tablespoon

Niacin = 14.29 mg/tablespoon

Choline = 14.29 mg/tablespoon

Inositol = 14.29 mg/tablespoon

Vitamin B-6 = 3.57 mg/tablespoon

Folic Acid = 0.057 mg/tablespoon

Vitamin B-12 = 0.0036 mg/tablespoon

Biotin = 0.0036 mg/tablespoon

Pantothenic Acid = 3.57 mg/tablespoon

Calcium = 160.71 mg/tablespoon

Iron = 1.29 mg/tablespoon

Phosphorus = 28.57 mg/tablespoon

Iodine = 0.0257 mg/tablespoon

Magnesium = 28.57 mg/tablespoon

Chromium = 0.0071 mg/tablespoon

Potassium = 14.29 mg/tablespoon

AMINO ACIDS:

Alanine = 28 mg/tablespoon

Arginine = 36.57 mg/tablespoon

Aspartic Acid = 42.43 mg/tablespoon

Cystine/Cysteine = 8.57 mg/tablespoon

Glutamic Acid = 60.57 mg/tablespoon

Glycine = 23.29 mg/tablespoon

Histidine = 10.14 mg/tablespoon

Isoleucine = 19.29 mg/tablespoon

Leucine = 39.14 mg/tablespoon

Lysine = 20.86 mg/tablespoon

Methionine = 16.71 mg/tablespoon

Phenylalanine = 23.86 mg/tablespoon

Proline = 24.29 mg/tablespoon

Serine = 23.57 mg/tablespoon

Threonine = 17.57 mg/tablespoon

Tryptophan = 6.86 mg/tablespoon

Tyrosine = 21 mg/tablespoon

Valine = 22.86 mg/tablespoon

Before I calculate the Herptivite figures I need to find out how many grams there are in a tablespoon of Herptivite...

Someone needs to microweigh it for me... or atleast find out how many tablespoons of herptivite is in an unopened container of Herptivite.

Thanks!

Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

AHHHH thank you Ern! You rock, man! 10 is such a perfect number, too. It'll make the calculations and conversions quick.

OK, I'll have the Herptivite figures for you guys soon.

Here is the Herptivite breakdown. I've calculated them in mg/tablespoon, assuming 10 g or 1000 mg of herptivite = 1 tablespoon.

The simple equation went like this:

x total mg of subtsance/ 1 kg of herptivite = y total milligrams of substance/ 0.01 kg of herptivite in a tablespoon. After calculating x, I solved for y.

I am crying out for someone to please feel free to correct me here incase I have made a mistake. It's about 3:15 AM right now so excuse me if I have erred. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I may have misplaced the decimal in the calculations but, after rechecking the numbers over a million and one times, I'm pretty sure I didn't.

Herptivite Break down

Vitamins:

Vitamin E – 36.67 mg/tablespoon

Choline – 44 mg/tablespoon

Niacin – 33 mg/tablespoon

Inositol – 25.3 mg/tablespoon

Ascorbic Acid (vit C) – 22 mg/tablespoon

P-Amino Benzoic Acid – 11 mg/tablespoon

Thiamine (B1) – 8.8 mg/tablespoon

Riboflavin (B2) – 5.5 mg/tablespoon

Vit. B6 – 5.5 mg/tablespoon

Beta Carotene – 4.4 mg/tablespoon

d-Pantothenic Acid – 3.3 mg/tablespoon

Folic Acid – 0.33 mg/tablespoon

Menadione – 0.22 mg/tablespoon

Vit. B12 – 0.0385 mg/tablespoon

Biotin - 0.0044 mg/tablespoon


Amino Acids:

Alanine (0.62%) – 61.93 mg/tablespoon

Arginine (0.58%) – 58.08 mg/tablespoon

Aspartic Acid (1.03%) – 102.63 mg/tablespoon

Cysteine (0.27%) – 27.17 mg/tablespoon

Glutamic Acid (1.32%) – 131.67 mg/tablespoon

Glycine (0.35%) – 34.87 mg/tablespoon

Histidine (0.23%) – 23.21 mg/tablespoon

Isoleucine (0.54%) – 54.45 mg/tablespoon

Leucine (0.64%) – 85.14 mg/tablespoon

Lysine (0.64%) - 63.91 mg/tablespoon

Methionine (0.38%) – 37.73 mg/tablespoon

Phenylalanine (0.59%) – 59.07 mg/tablespoon

Proline (0.39%) – 38.72 mg/tablespoon

Serine (0.69%) – 68.64 mg/tablespoon

Threonine (0.46%) – 45.54 mg/tablespoon

Tryptophan (0.17%) 16.50 mg/tablespoon

Tyrosine (0.40%) – 39.71 mg/tablespoon

Valine ( 0.70%) – 69.74 mg/tablespoon


Minerals:

Calcium min (2.2%) – 220.00 mg/tablespoon

Calcium max (2.3%) – 230.00 mg/tablespoon

Phosphorus (1.1%) – 110.00 mg/tablespoon

Salt min (0.13%) – 13.20 mg/tablespoon

Salt max (0.14%) – 13.85 mg/tablespoon

Magnesium (0.01%) – 0.99 mg/tablespoon

Potassium (0.17%) – 16.50 mg/tablespoon

Sulfer (0.55%) – 55.00 mg/tablespoon

Now as for this stuff here, ppm means parts per million. What are the constants and units for these? Until I know them I can't calculate the amounts of these...

Copper – 165 ppm
Iodine – 38.5 ppm
Iron – 3,850 ppm
Manganese – 330 ppm
Zinc – 330 ppm

That's funny... Hmmm... I thought I remember Bourbon mentioning once that one of the reasons they opted to use the Reptile Vitamins (i.e. Herptivite) was because it had lower doeses of substances than the mammal vits. According to the calculations, this is untrue, at least compared to Pricilla's Vits. I'm still pretty positive that I didn't misplace a decimal anywhere.

Perhaps the fact that the Herptivite wasn't leveled off before measuring the total grams in a tablespoon accounts for the margin of error. However, I doubt many people remember to level off the Herptivite when scooping it with the tablespoon before they mix it into the BML...

Interesting...

Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

good work Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />
I'm sure your brain hurts by now, lol <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/roflmao.gif" alt="" />
I know my brain hurts just looking at the figures, but certainly some interesting info to be able to compare.

The only thing that I'm thinking of is the fact that both vitamins are made to complement different diets.
If you wanted to get a more true comparison, then it might be necessary to take into account the complete figures of both diets?

The only thing(if I recall correctly)that has kept anyone from doing a complete analysis of the petglider diet, and consequently a comparison of the two diets that use the respective vitamins, was the fact that the statistics for thepetglider multivitamin were unknown and unavailable. Since this is no longer the case maybe we could at least do a comparison? This is by no means to imply that one is better than the other, but just something that would be a good point of reference <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

YES, Ern! You're still awake! Wicked!

Ah, I see. You're right, man. You would have to take the entire diet into account really have any level of comparison. That would certainly be a challenge and quite the mathematical venture, seeing as there are so many factors, like what constituents the individual chooses for the BML mixture (seeing as there are several possibilites like the use of different brands of babyfood, yogurt, juice with yogurt, etc), fruits/veggies combos, and so on... I suspect even simple things like the type of honey used for BML would be significant enough to cause some significant variance in nutritional values.

My next question is (I'm too lazy to check at this time of night), do you offer the same amount of fruits and vegetables in the BML as you do in the petglider diet? If so, that would certainly cut a lot of work off for us, because then we could simply have the amounts of nutrients provided by the fruits/veggie component cancel eachother out, and we won't even have to worry about that uncontrolled factor (i.e. calculating the nutrional values of different fruits/veggies which would be impossible seeing as there are endless combos)!

Anyway, I'm off to bed now. I am going to die at the gym tomorrow if I don't get some shut eye. LOL. I'll check on this thread in the morning! Peace, Ern!

Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

Hey Mikey, Real quick, Big Ern DID level the scoop, so that shouldn't have thrown you off.

And WOW!!!!!! YOU ARE A MAD MATH GENIUS!

I agree with Ern on the comparison thing. The vits are to complement two different diets, so be careful how the comparison is conducted.

I'm so glad I could get this info out there. I have to say I am rather impressed with Priscilla's vitamin, it looks really good.

Keep in mind also when doing all glider diet analysis/comparison: We do not necessarily have anything "controlled" to compare our results to. So what we are really starting here is like a data base of info that at some point someone could utilize to someday figure out the true complete dietary needs of PET gliders. I know everyone wants to have this "as natural as possible" diet, but I don't feed my cat live mice or birds every night, he gets high grade cat food that was created after years and years of good hard research and colaboration between lots of hard working people. Same concept here. Now, I am a truly lazy person outside of 40 hours of work a week and a full time University Schedual, LOL. So I'll leave all this calculation stuff up to you guys.

FYI - I'll try to take Mikey's calculations and place them into a table/excel spreedsheat either today or tomorrow. I probably will not post it, I'll just mail it to those who need it for analysis.

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
However, I doubt many people remember to level off the Herptivite when scooping it with the tablespoon before they mix it into the BML...


<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Mikey, it's a teaspoon per batch of BML...just didn't want to throw anyone off <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />.

Karin

OH yes... my bad, Karin... That's right - teaspoon. Thanks Karin, I missed that one.

Also, you're right Nihm, the tablespoon was levelled off. I can't believe I misread what Ern had said. Number crunching chips away at your sanity. lol No wonder Einstein was such a nut job! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/roflmao.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/offtopic.gif" alt="" /> From what I've read that guy had the most erratic sleeping patterns sleeping for 15 minutes, then staying awake for 15 minutes, then sleeping again for 15 minutes, and this pattern would go on for the entire 24 hour cycle! Wierdo...

Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

I too am really impressed with Pricillas Vitamins. As I mentioned I had made the mix before, then when I realized it was to be fed with HER vitamins I looked long and hard at them. I thought everything looked really good. I made the decision not to go with it based solely on price though.
Thanks so much Mikey for doing all those calculations!
This has been a very interesting and informative thread. Thanks to everyone for your input. I just keep on a checkin back for all the new good info!

[:"blue"] Somehow, I totally missed the last part of this thread???? Good thing I guess as Mikey did all of the calculations and saved me the time. I can see one thing I would like to do.....present the information in a side by side format so that it is a little easier to compare the materials. Keep in mind that I have no expectation of offering any sort of an opinion about which is the better material. We don't know how much calcium a glider needs or how much Vitamin A or zinc or any of the other Vitus and minerals in these supplements so saying that one is better than the other is probably a little foolish unless some unless there is obvious and glaring problem, which I doubt will happen.

Some time ago I did a simple nutritional analysis of of the BML diet and presented figures for the fruits, veggies and the BML mix but never did combine all of the figures into a final analysis. All of the work is done and I really have just been dragging my big feet. Guess I need to get my $$$$ in gear and post the final results. Then I could start working on Priscilla's diet. Couldn't do that before because I didn't have the vitamin analysis and that is no longer a problem. Thanks to everyone for all of the good information. [/]

[:"blue"] Leyna was so kind as to locate this thread which I had lost track of. Good thing she did as there appear to be a few unfinished pieces of business. I have a few belated comments concerning a subject near and dear to my heart. Going to mention these in the order they showed up in the thread and not necessarily in the importance of their value to the subject.

Don’t know where Amanda got here figures for Herptivite; but the values are exactly half of what is shown on the label of my Herptivite container. That is obviously going to screw up the calculations if the numbers are not correct. If someone out there has a Herptivite container and can either confirm or discount the figures, it would be very much appreciated.

The fact that the Herptivite figures are in question, gives me pause to wonder about the PetGlider vitamin figures. Listing figures in terms of values for 7 tbs. of material is a little unusual. If Amanda can confirm that what she posted is exactly as it came from Priscilla, I would feel a little better. [/]



“…..UGHHH I'd do the math but I hate working with ounces... You Americans... when will you guys convert to the SI metric system like the rest of the world?
[:"blue"] Actually. Mikey the US did convert to the metric system about 20 years ago,maybe longer?? Only problem is nobody knows it, not even the average American??? [/]



"...Someone needs to microweigh it for me... or atleast find out how many tablespoons of herptivite is in an unopened container of Herptivite..."
[:"blue"] When I did my work on the BML diet, I had to resolve the question about the weight of Herptivite. I used a very accurate scale.....could measure to 1/7000 lb or 0.06 gram.....and took multiple(25) measurements and calculated an average. My result was about 20% less than Ernie’s. I would like to know more about how Ern came up with his value as I suspect it may off a little. [/]



“...i converted all the IU figures to total mg...”
[:"blue"] Mikey: Not quite sure why you converted IU figures to micrograms?? Here in the US we are used to discussing vitamin dosages in IUs rather than mcg. Is that a Canadian thing or was it just late at night?? [/]



“...I've calculated them in mg/tablespoon, assuming 10 g or 1000 mg of herptivite = 1 tablespoon...”
[:"blue"] Mikey: Is the above a typo, or is this the actual figure you used?? 10 grams is actually equal to 10,000 mg!!! [/]



“...That's funny... Hmmm... I thought I remember Bourbon mentioning once that one of the reasons they opted to use the Reptile Vitamins (i.e. Herptivite) was because it had lower doeses of substances than the mammal vits. According to the calculations, this is untrue, at least compared to Pricilla's Vits. I'm still pretty positive that I didn't misplace a decimal anywhere...”
[:"blue"] I haven’t actually checked the individual numbers yet; but from my previous comments, you can see there is a good possibility that there are some problems with these figures. The argument about using RepVits because of lower doses is spurious. If a particular vitamin is more or less potent, you simply feed more or less of it as appropriate. The dosage argument is a smokescreen. [/]



“...The only thing that I'm thinking of is the fact that both vitamins are made to complement different diets. If you wanted to get a more true comparison, then it might be necessary to take into account the complete figures of both diets...”
[:"blue"] ERN: If you look at most of the popular glider diets used today, they are really not all that much different... fruit...veggies...protein...misc. treats. I think it is reasonable to assume the required vitamin and mineral supplements needed for the different diets will not be terribly different??? [/]

I can't beleive I missed this thread the first time around! Very interesting! A toughie indeed - And I don't think you're ever going to get a complete breakdown of Pricilla's vitamins - at least not until they're patented and you're reading it off the package! I really like some of the "extra" ingredients she has added though, you can tell she did her homework!

Oh, goodness... this thread! Oh boy! Here goes nothing...

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
Don’t know where Amanda got here figures for Herptivite; but the values are exactly half of what is shown on the label of my Herptivite container. That is obviously going to screw up the calculations if the numbers are not correct. If someone out there has a Herptivite container and can either confirm or discount the figures, it would be very much appreciated.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

You're kidding?! LOL You mean the initial figures provided before all the number crunching were incorrect?! Oh my God! All that work... *trying not to pass out now*


</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
“…..UGHHH I'd do the math but I hate working with ounces... You Americans... when will you guys convert to the SI metric system like the rest of the world?
Actually. Mikey the US did convert to the metric system about 20 years ago,maybe longer?? Only problem is nobody knows it, not even the average American???

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Well, you Americanos need to get crackin'! LOL!


</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
“...i converted all the IU figures to total mg...”
Mikey: Not quite sure why you converted IU figures to micrograms?? Here in the US we are used to discussing vitamin dosages in IUs rather than mcg. Is that a Canadian thing or was it just late at night??

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Some of the initial vitamin figures (e.g. Vitamin C, K, and Vitamin B series figures) were provided in mg. Perhaps, I converted the UI's to mg for better visualization of the amounts. I don't remember for sure... I'll look into it...


</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
“...That's funny... Hmmm... I thought I remember Bourbon mentioning once that one of the reasons they opted to use the Reptile Vitamins (i.e. Herptivite) was because it had lower doeses of substances than the mammal vits. According to the calculations, this is untrue, at least compared to Pricilla's Vits. I'm still pretty positive that I didn't misplace a decimal anywhere...”
I haven’t actually checked the individual numbers yet; but from my previous comments, you can see there is a good possibility that there are some problems with these figures. The argument about using RepVits because of lower doses is spurious. If a particular vitamin is more or less potent, you simply feed more or less of it as appropriate. The dosage argument is a smokescreen.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

This fact that herptivite has lower doses was from an MSN conversation I had with Bourbon back when we were debating on diets earlier this year. I had the conversation saved and this was one of the reasons she mentioned that she chose Herptivite for the BML. She mentioned it was in lower doses. Perhaps what she was referring to was that the ratios of the doses of the vitmains/minerals were lower. In other words, perhaps other vitamins out there like the various mammal vitamins had a greater degree of variance among the different vitamins/minerals where as the Herptivite had figures which were comparatively close to eachother.


</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
“...I've calculated them in mg/tablespoon, assuming 10 g or 1000 mg of herptivite = 1 tablespoon...”
Mikey: Is the above a typo, or is this the actual figure you used?? 10 grams is actually equal to 10,000 mg!!!

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Yes, that was a typo! LOL It was definitely too late for me to be shifting decimals accurately! I don't think ti affected my calculations, though, and if it did so help me God I will run around the block in only my boxers screaming my head off!

Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

[:"blue"] I have taken the numbers that Mikey computed and arranged them in the form of a chart that will make a comparison of the two supplements a little easier to accomplish. I made a couple of corrections and recalculated a few of the values so that the units of measure were the same for each of the items. As I mentioned in a previous post, I have a "STRONG" suspicion that these values are "NOT" correct. Mikey's math seems to be OK for the most part; but there is a real possibility that the figures he was given to work with may be inaccurate. Hopefully, that issue will be resolved shortly and we can get an accurate set of figures in your hands for review. I have posted the chart as an attachment as this type of data doesn't display well on the message screen. [/]

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"...Someone needs to microweigh it for me... or atleast find out how many tablespoons of herptivite is in an unopened container of Herptivite..."
When I did my work on the BML diet, I had to resolve the question about the weight of Herptivite. I used a very accurate scale.....could measure to 1/7000 lb or 0.06 gram.....and took multiple(25) measurements and calculated an average. My result was about 20% less than Ernie’s. I would like to know more about how Ern came up with his value as I suspect it may off a little.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> I used a level spoon and I also used a triple beam scale. It's pretty accurate. It's not off far enough to account for a 20% difference. I've got a 100g/10g/1g weight set to keep it on track. Did you use a digital scale? They aren't always as accurate as you think. Even though a scale may have a number of decimal points and claim to weigh delicate amounts, they aren't always right on the money, no matter if you weigh 25 or 100 times. Do you have weights to establish the accuracy of your scale? If you're worried about it, just use your weight figures for comparison I'm not really sure where the discrepancy lies.

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Also includes:
-Calcium sup approved through the FDA
-nectar, bee pollen, milk thistle for healthy liver function, probiotics for the immune system and for better absorption of nutrients, and Gum Arabic (from the Acacia species) a carbohydrate high in calcium

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

In the analysis of Pricilla's vits wouldn't these items have an important impact? Seems to me that these items would have to be broken down by quantity and the results factored into the values that are being presented. After all they are a part of the vitamin package. Just curious.
Charlie H

Oky Doky Ern....
I copy and pasted EXACTLY what Pricilla gave me via email into the thread, so that should be completely verbatum.

The Rep vits I had to data entry myself, but I got them directly off my container of herptivite....maybe you have a bigger container than me? Both my Herptivite and Calcium came from PetsMarts, and they are the same brand Bourbon gives pics for on the BML recipe.

Sorry, guys, I hope I didn't enter the data wrong! I swear I got the BML vit #'s right off the backs of the plastic containers I bought them in.

It's OK Nihm! Don't apologize. All this nutritional stuff, like any science can get quite complex and intensive! Your figures were very helpful and if it weren't for you we probably wouldn't have ever known Pricilla's vitamin breakdown any time soon <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" /> .

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
The Rep vits I had to data entry myself, but I got them directly off my container of herptivite....maybe you have a bigger container than me?

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Hmmm... I don't think the size of the Herptivite container would have affected the calculations because we calculated the amounts of the different vits/minerals/nutrients in the Herptivite in mg/tablespoon anyway.

Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />

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.....Did you use a digital scale.....

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

[:"blue"] LOL!! Ern: I was going to ask you the same question. Looks like you did everything right. I have a balance scale used for reloading firearms ammunition and it is accurate to 0.06 grams so we are both using scales that are more than accurate enough for this little project. There are two possible explanations that I can see for the difference. The most obvious and the one least considered is the accuracy of the "tablespoon!!" Most tablespoons are cheap little molded plastic gizmos from Taiwan or some such place and are not what one might reasonably call a precision measuring device. Other difficulty is the issue of "packing." When I did my work, initially, I had a lot of trouble getting consistent results from measurement to measurement. Whet I finally decided was that due to settling and packing, the first scoop out of the container weighed more than subsequent scoops because the material got stirred up a little. What I ended up doing is sifting the Herptivite through a flower sifter before every measurement to make sure it was as uniform as possible in consistency. Probably a little bit of overkill; but by doing that, the measurements became much more consistent. As a side note, I went so far as to write the manufacturer and asked them for the weight. They told me 7 grams...I measured 8 grams and you got 10 grams. Clearly, establishing this number is not as easy as one might think. Anyway, thanks for the information...we are in the ballpark!!! [/]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
.....maybe you have a bigger container than me.....

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

[:"blue"] Thanks, Amanda. I trust you. Size of the container doesn't matter as the figures are quoted in units per kg not units per container. Only thing that comes to mind immediately is that Rep-Cal has changed their formulation and are putting out a less concentrated material. Sure would be helpful if someone else could check their label and see what is going on???

My container has an expiration date of FEB 2003 on it. Amanda: Could you check the date on your container, please?? Maybe you have more current information?? Guess I will have to email Rep-Cal or maybe Sheila will be able to help with this??

Let's not all panic; but if the formulation has been changed, it will be necessary to adjust the BML formula to compensate for any potential in the Herptivite formulation!!! [/]

Wow! I missed this one entirely until just now. I just read through it and find it to be very interesting. I was just asking Pockets if she new the comparison between Nekton sugar glider and the high protein wombaroo diet that is coming from Australia. I don't have any numbers or I would offer them. I will see what I can find out if you all would be willing to do some more math.

Again thanks guys for all your work on this it is great info and helps one to make an informed decision.

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
.....Hmmm... I don't think the size of the Herptivite container would have affected the calculations.....

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Correct Mikey!!!

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.....In the analysis of Pricilla's vits wouldn't these items have an important impact? Seems to me that these items would have to be broken down by quantity and the results factored into the values that are being presented. After all they are a part of the vitamin package......

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[:"blue"] Charlie: Yes and no.....sheer speculation on my part; but this is my thinking. The vitamins and minerals and amino acids in the supplement are in relatively concentrated form whereas the other ingredients you mentioned probably are not. If that is true, the VMAs will have a large impact on the numbers while the others won't. As an analogy it would be sort of like adding some "treats" to a pure vitamin supplement. Certainly, if one were to look at the total diet, these items would have to be considered; but I suspect they don't have a major impact on the total VMA values of Priscilla's supplement. Again, this is just speculation and may be totally off base. [/]